He is starting the conversation, President Obama is saying the words "tax increase" when he speaks about a deficit reduction package. This is what a huge majority of Americans want to hear from our POTUS. Pres. Obama is insisting on 400 billion in tax increases, it's a starting point and we all know this is the way to move forward, but those pesky know it all Republicans, they won't have any of it! "Raising taxes in a bad economy will only make matters worse" Blah Blah FuckinBlah...We know the truth, tax increases actually help spur economic growth, so why do they keep fighting the inevitable??
Finally Pres. Obama says something we can cheer about.."If we choose to keep those tax breaks for millionaires and billionaires, if we choose to keep a tax break for corporate jet owners, if we choose to keep tax breaks for oil and natural gas companies that are making hundreds of billions of dollars, then that means we've got to cut some kids off from getting a college scholarship, that means we've got to stop funding certain grants for medical research, that means that food safety may be compromised, that means that Medicare has to bear a greater part of the burden."
Amazingly we keep hearing the Republican leaders say the president is not engaged, he is not serious about the debt crisis, but it's the Republicans who are walking out on talks, it is Republicans who THREATEN the president and Democrats if they do not get their way! (ok, blood boiling..) The GOPers are insisting there is NO support among Republicans to impose the kind of tax increases the president is proposing..."The president is sorely mistaken if he believes a bill to raise taxes would pass the House" says The Tan Man...Games, games, fuckingamesplaying...
The GOP is showing their true colors, and the country is not amused. The Republicans could care less about college bound kids, clean, safe food, Medicare patients, they surely don't care about cancer research and burdens on middle class families! Do you ever hear the words Middle Class come out of the mouths of those GOPers??
This is what the Republicans are balking at...
limiting deductions for high income families and small businesses
eliminating 41 billion in tax breaks for oil and natural gas companies
raising taxes on investment fund managers
phasing out itemized deductions for people making more than 500,000
phasing out LIFO
Does this list look radical to you?? To Grover Norquist and his organization Americans for Tax Reform, it is radical and goes against everything they stand for, NO NEW TAXES. The Taxpayer Protection Pledge created 25 yrs. ago has taken our nation hostage. Our current leaders in Congress have signed this pledge to the detriment of our people! When in the history of our nation has there been no tax when we are at war? Dubya signed the fuckinpledge and took our nation to war, TWICE, TWO WARS and NO new taxes to pay for those wars...
Republiscums in Washington today are willing to default on our country's obligations in order to abide by this pledge, a pledge made up by a mere mortal! What the fuck is wrong with them? These same people call President Obama an evil-doer working overtime to destroy our America, but it is NOT Pres. Obama who follows blindly a single man with a pledge, a pledge that has no place in our Congress, this pledge taking precedence with our elected leaders, one single pledge signed by our Congressmen putting our entire nation at risk...
June 23rd Mitt Romney signed the pledge
June 26th Michele Bachmann signed the pledge
Stepford Wives (and husbands)
13 hours ago
34 comments:
We are 14 trillion dollars in debt. Obviously we have a revenue problem. That debt, is the Republicans fault. Since RR they cried for and got their tax cuts, yet, no spending cuts. Now they want to destroy the government by cutting everything regardless of how it will hurt America. How stupid are these Republican bastards? Should America follow the advice of the idiots who got us in this financial crisis in the first place? Fool me once shame on you. Fool me twice shame on me. Americans, pull your heads out of your asses.
It's not just Democrats who are criticizing the Republican's so-called economic "plan." Non-partisan groups and conservative economists are calling it a one-way ticket to disaster. Not only is this further proof that Republicans don't listen, they don't care about the citizens and they don't care about the country.
Lisa, really? More false facts? As Tom has pointed out Sue, it does take more than just cuts to balance the budget.
Here's my worry.
The GOP will oppose raising the debt ceiling, and then offer to pay whatever we need to pay to service that debt, leaving the US economy with nothing.
They will then say they fulfilled our debt obligations, thereby keeping our foreign debt holders/investors happy, and be able to starve domestic programs "on the vine" [yes, it is a classic Newt line] as there will be no money left after social security, medicare, and defense are funded.
Keep an eye out for this scenario... I fear it is coming...
I hope nobody minds, but lisas false facts aen't allowed to grace my blog....
Tom, good morning, Yes we still have idiots in our society who follow blindly a party that wants to kill off the poor and the middle class so just the elite are laft standing. What is so odd about these religious Righties is this is not the way of Jesus...Let them eat their cake, for the MEEK shall inherit the Earth!! Be afraid rich elitists, be Afraid...Bwahaaaahaaaahaaaa
L, Republicans listen to their masters and only their masters. They are buffoons who hate the American people! We are nothing but a bother to them. They go around the country claiming to listen but the town halls and the protests of discontented citizens who get mocked and yelled at and even arrested by rethuglicans are what we are seeing more and more of. The people ARE NOT HAPPY and are speaking out! There will be so many recalls of those hideous fascists!
Dave I hope you are wrong. Think of a scenario where the millions of honest, decent Americans worked their whole lives and now as seniors collect their rightful SS checks, but because of the Republicans claims of concern about our debt and deficits, our seniors and disabled and veterans do not get their checks. Will this be enough for a revolution, an uprising so large the republican party becomes mute for generations to come?? That is my dream scenario!
"But even if Obama were to gain all the tax-law changes he wants, new revenue would make up only about 15 cents of each dollar in deficit reduction in the package."
His starting point is 15%. What he ends up with will be even less.
Alan Simpson said:
“We’re at 15 percent revenue, and historically it’s been closer to 20 percent.” He added, “We’ve never had a war without a tax, and now we’ve got two. … Absolute bullshit.”
Obviously we have a spending problem. Wasteful spending stretching from the Defense department to the furniture in the Oval Office, and everywhere in between.
Uncontrolled spending, and yes this includes spending for the statist wars of both republicans and democrats, absolutely must be brought under control.
The answer for progressives is to tax, tax, and tax some more... and in that process redistribute the wealth. IE: Make everyone poorer so Leviathan can step in and help.
For the extreme right the answer is to starve the government thus forcing it to be more fiscally responsible.
Government does need revenue to function. The task is finding the delicate balance that does not kill economic competitiveness, does not turn our nation into Venezuela, provides for our defense without the seemingly incessant and senseless wars, etc.
And we must stop being the world's cash cow and start taking care of business at home. The problems of other nations should not become the problems of our nation unless they directly threaten our self interests.
Now that I got that off my chest I realize what Reagan realized... the fine art of negotiation must be employed and compromise must be an option.
Problem is it seems neither the progressives nor the far right want to compromise on anything sensible.
Happy Independence Day tomorrow!
Jerry, all I can say is let the people suffer and suffer greatly, it's the only way this country will wake up and smell the raunchy garbage our elected leaders are throwing at us
don't say progressives don't want to compromise!! Our side has given to we are at bare bones and even then the GOP wants to suck them dry!! Chew on that RN!
Yes there MUST be a balance, do you see the GOP agreeing to that?? NO!!
Taxes do not make everyone poorer as RN would like you to believe. In fact, if properly spent here at home instead of on overseas adventures, the economic return is much greater than what is spent, and everyone benefits.
The problem is that republicans don't want everyone to benefit.
Fence sitting again RN,
It's the Republicans who will not negotiate in good faith, or compromise.
One of Obama's biggest complaints from Democrats, is his bending over for Republicans.
Since you support and vote for Republicans (for decades) you are part of the problem and this "both parties are responsible" crap, is just that; and hypocritical coming from you.
By the way I am not anon. on you blog. I'm not afraid to speak to you identified as myself. You, on the other hand, did post as anon on my blog, until I blocked your address from commenting on my blog. So keep blaming anyone who plugs into your hate, for being anon, idiot.
Jerry - You said...
"if properly spent here at home instead of on overseas adventures, the economic return is much greater than what is spent, and everyone benefits."
I agree. Extrapolate that logic to unnecessary foreign aid in full, subsidies, and other wasteful duplication in spending by the government and we likely wouldn't need to consider raising taxes.
Sue - Both sides are part of the problem. Both ides remain part of the problem.
Only a few are really part of the solution. Most are listening to them. On either side.
Hoo-rah, isn't it such fun? After all what would bloggers di if everyone agreed?!*%# :)
In less than 30 years Republican fiscal policies drove America to a 12 trillion dollar debt. I guess 30 years is not enough proof, that their fiscal policies are a failure. Some idiots need more proof, like when America fails.
Yet Clinton (the only Democratic President within those 30 years) created 23 million jobs and a budget surplus. If not for Bush we would have been paying down the debt, for ten years now.
But don't let facts get in your way.
Even if we were to cut programs that Americans want, voted for, and need, when do we pay off the Republican multi-trillion dollar debt?
America has become a bunch of cheap bastards, who enjoy their selfish free lunch government.
The idea of sacrificing a few bucks (as their parents and grandparents did) to build and maintain the best country in the World, is not important to them.
Disagreements are one thing; obvious, dangerous mistakes (Republican fiscal policies) have to be avoided. You know, lessons from History.
Alternatives? Sure, you can go to RN's Ayn Rand garbage cult blog and see why her ideology was rejected 60 years ago.
It's not a matter of new ideas, it's using ideas we already know work.
Facts tell us Republican ideas are a failure.
Well done and kudos my friend! I think Obama puts on a more gracious face publicly. But in private he's a much more tough negotiator than alot of us realize. I've read many accounts from insiders who back me up on this too.
Les, have we not been cutting taxes? How has that worked for our deficit and the economy?
If we simply rescinded the Bush tax cuts, in 10 years, we'd be 4 trillion to the good, even with no spending cuts.
How about if both sides agree to this...
The GOP supports eliminating the Bush Tax Cuts and the Dems agree over the 10 years, to decrease spending by an equal amount?
Why can't we look at that type of balanced approach?
Even Reagan supported higher taxes. Is this about balancing the budget, or is it, as I suspect, about starving government?
Dave,
My guess it's about no compromise so nothing gets done and we sink deeper into a malaise so that the GOP can blame Obama for it all. I believe the GOP cares more about winning elections than they do about fixing the economy and being good citizens.
It's all so evident in their behavior.
When you want to lose weight, you eat less and exercise more.
When you want to attack the deficit, you spend less and tax more.
Why is that so hard to understand?
Dave - You said...
"How about if both sides agree to this...
The GOP supports eliminating the Bush Tax Cuts and the Dems agree over the 10 years, to decrease spending by an equal amount?
Why can't we look at that type of balanced approach?
Even Reagan supported higher taxes. Is this about balancing the budget, or is it, as I suspect, about starving government?
Dave I tend to agree with your statement, and were I a congressional representative I would seriously consider your approach. After all the specifics and fine print were made available so all could see and understand.
We definitely need to put the government on a diet, not starve it to death.
Agreed?
Sue,
Off topic, but you should know and you can read RN's blog for the comments; but I offered to let Les post on my blog and he refused a good faith effort to be civil. He would rather be what we see hear on your blog. Irascible, to put it mildly. I removed him from my blacklist and he can now post on my blog, but I will not put up with his crap.
If you are civil RN come on over.
Don't try to BS Sue, and others who were witness to your attacks on my blog and supported me during that time.
The government is not the problem. It is simply a structure created by the Constitution. The problem is the politicians who run it. You can't starve the government, but you can starve the politicians. I'd start by cutting off the lobbyists and corporate/union money.
So Les, in light of the fact that are Dems willing to cut spending, but the GOP has signed the Norquist pledge, what are we to do?
Based on the above, what party seems to be more irresponsible one out there now?
PS... agreed...
Jerry - with your last comment... "You can't starve the government, but you can starve the politicians. I'd start by cutting off the lobbyists and corporate/union money"... I have no problem.
Dave - let us see exactly what, and how much they are willing to cut.
I don't trust the dems any more than you, or I, trust the republicans.
Tom - I am not trying to BS. I have merely stated a fact and the truth.
In the spirit of conciliation... I will stop in at your site and comment if I have anything to say.
Oh, and by the way, I WILL NOT TOLERATE YOUR BS either.
PS: Thanks for stopping in at RN today and leaving a reasonable comment.
Happy Independence Day Tom, and all the rest of the visitors here as well.
Happy Independence Day you lovable lunatics! America is still the greatest country on earth even if it is inhabited by people like us.
The water temp on San Diego beaches finally hit 68 degrees after a long, rainy La Niňa spring. I got a bit of a sunburn, but my ocean-loving dogs are about the happiest I have seen them all year. The grandkids are learning to boogie board and skim. There were lots of old hippies and surfers out today, almost as many as the young people. We were partying brothers and sisters. Hope you all have a lovely holiday.
wait just one minute FJ! You mean to tell me you are an old hippie with grandkids?? And here I pictured you as a thirty something Brad Pitt type!!
Glad you are enjoying the ocean, wish I was there!
Happy 4th everyone!!
"Arguments over how much government should tax and spend are the very stuff of democracy’s give-and-take. Now, the debate is shadowed by worries that if a willful faction does not get what it wants, it might bring the nation to default."
"In the long list of “abuses and usurpations” the Declaration documents, taxes don’t come up until the 17th item, and that item is neither a complaint about tax rates nor an objection to the idea of taxation. Our Founders remonstrated against the British crown “for imposing taxes on us without our consent.” They were concerned about “consent,” i.e. popular rule, not taxes."
http://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/what-our-declaration-really-said/2011/07/02/AGugyvwH_story.html?hpid=z3
Well I was born in the summer of 1959, so I'm not a neo-hippie, that's for sure. Brad Pitt turns forty-eight this year. Wild living, rock scrambling and lots of bicycle riding keep a person young. Have a good summer everyone.
I said Brad Pitt "type", not that he was thirty something... ok cool, you're one of us 50 somethings..I do call myself an old hippie with pride and a nod to my past. Those days so long ago bring a smile to my face and a longing for the good ole days...
thanks L, proof once more the Right doesn't know, or just can't read and understand with clarity, what is in the Declaration or the Constitution for that matter.
LP -You said...
""Arguments over how much government should tax and spend are the very stuff of democracy’s give-and-take..."
Well said!
Post a Comment